Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hey, I'm James from Content Snare and this is between two Ledgers. Today's guest is Jackie Trumper from Black Cat Accounting. I met Jackie quite a while ago before she'd gone out on her own to create her own firm. And I've watched her journey and her obsession with efficiency into building the firm that she has today. We get into lots of topics today, including networking as an introvert, how Jackie started her own accounting firm, choosing best in class tech versus all in one software. And the collaboration culture in accounting, which I've always found really impressive in this industry. And of course we get into other topics as well. And with that, I bring you Jackie Trapper.
Hello, Jackie. Welcome to the show.
[00:00:44] Speaker B: Hello. Thank you for having me.
[00:00:46] Speaker A: It is. I feel like this has been a long time coming. You've been. I see you everywhere at every event that I go to.
You have been a very avid supporter of Content Snare since the early days
[00:00:58] Speaker B: or a stalker, one of the two.
[00:01:01] Speaker A: I love it. Yeah, I mean I see you in like the accounting Facebook groups everywhere. You're always being very helpful.
So I think there is a lot for people to learn from you, especially around starting your own thing. Because when I first met you, I don't remember. I'm pretty sure it was at the.
[00:01:18] Speaker B: It was ca meet up in the second.
[00:01:21] Speaker A: At that point. Had you already started your own thing during the process?
[00:01:25] Speaker B: No, I was working for someone else and.
[00:01:27] Speaker A: Pretty big firm, right?
[00:01:29] Speaker B: No, no, Suburban firm.
[00:01:30] Speaker A: I like it.
[00:01:31] Speaker B: Cool, smallish suburban firm. And I managed to convince them to let me leave work early to go to this meetup because I was just sick of.
It was a dinosaur firm that had no imagination. The management had no imagination in terms of software and processes and. And improvements to that. It was old school.
And so I just want to get out of the office and go and be amongst people who seem to be not old school. And so I convinced them to let me go to this on the. On the basis of reporting back on what other people suffer, other people are using. And then they proceeded to ignore my report. But yeah, that's why. And I thought you were an accountant. I thought everyone there was an accountant. And then you, you said what you actually did. I'm like, hell yes, we need this.
[00:02:12] Speaker A: That's funny.
[00:02:13] Speaker B: So then it was in the back of my mind for the next six or eight months until I did start my own business.
[00:02:18] Speaker A: Wow, six or eight months.
Interesting to me, like this is off topic, but still I think helpful. But I always talk about how much of a powerful Tool networking is. Right. And that was basically my first event or very close to it in the accounting industry. Right. Like that's how early that was for content snare, at least our journey into accounting because before we were for web designers.
Now I found out about that event and I went to it and I like, I used to network as a web design agency many years before that, like probably five years. And I hadn't really done much networking in that time. And I went to that event, I knew like four or five people there from back in the day and then was introduced to people like you and like Peter from Ignition who was like super supportive and Ignition. I just like, it was crazy because the amount that came out of that, like obviously you as an early supporter and like Ignition ended up being a pretty good like a big supporter of us. They refer people to us quite regularly. It's just like that became because of like my networking from like five plus years earlier. It's just crazy how that.
[00:03:23] Speaker B: It's a small world.
[00:03:25] Speaker A: Yeah. But I just think like, yeah, once you get to know people, it God like it's a little bit of effort and obviously if you're introverted, it's more difficult. You're an introvert. Do you count yourself as an introvert?
[00:03:35] Speaker B: Yep. Absolutely.
[00:03:36] Speaker A: And you were at every event?
[00:03:37] Speaker B: Yep. Yeah. I decided a few years ago to just go out of my comfort zone and say yes to going to things in the hopes that if I went to more things it would become easier. And I've met people, but no introvert.
[00:03:49] Speaker A: Has it become easier though?
[00:03:50] Speaker B: Only insofar as I'm. I know more people now and people know me, so it's less awkward.
[00:03:57] Speaker A: Yeah. I mean one of the hardest bits is going like meeting new people. Like if you go to an event, you know no one, it's like it is, yes. It's obviously nerve wracking, especially if you're an introvert, to go and talk to people you've never met. But it's also like draining. Like I'm very much an extrovert, but it's still like it's so easy to go and talk to a group of people when you know one person. Right. Like it's just a not issue. You don't even have to think about it. But then if it's an entire room of new people, it's like so much mental. Like the mental effort must be like
[00:04:30] Speaker B: 10 times like sending him a corner hiding and then going, okay, let's go because this is.
[00:04:35] Speaker A: Yeah, we'll come back to events Because I think that the thing I'd like to talk about is that process of you starting the firm, your own firm, and like, you know, seemingly doing pretty well, pretty quick. If there's anything you can share there around like, you know, that makes it pretty, you know, obvious that you're doing well or like where you're at now. But I know what I've always found impressive is your focus on efficiency and processes.
So that's kind of where I want to dial in here. And you did that first. It was. You went into this new firm.
[00:05:06] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:05:06] Speaker A: Thinking like, I want stuff to be efficient. And I'm guessing that's an artifact of you working with a firm that worked.
[00:05:12] Speaker B: Working for dinosaur firm. Yeah. So I, A few jobs ago I worked for a firm that was a full zero cloud based firm. And it was my first introduction, having come from big city, old school, mid tier firm, my first introduction to Xero and to the whole ecosystem. And I fell in love with it.
And so a lot of what I did when I started my own business was based on that. So Ignition, they used ignition. I'm like, I like that. We'll go with that. Zero, obviously, we'll go with that. And then I work for old school dinosaur firm.
And that dinosaurness is in large part what caused me to leave that firm is they, they sat on it and they. I was there for about two, just over two years. And that entire time they were, yeah, we need to do something, we need to do something. We acknowledge we need to do something. And it was all just discussion. We'll just talk. And no actual, no actual things. And I just got annoyed.
[00:06:09] Speaker A: I mean, right there, like the fact that they were asking you to report back or you did that and then no action was taken. Like that is how you demoralize the crap out of your employees. Right there.
[00:06:19] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like at one stage, myself and another lady were talking to the director and he's like, no, we, we don't need an Instagram preference presence. People don't find accountants on Instagram. And she's like, well, actually I got us a new accountant, a new client via my Instagram account yesterday. So there's just no, there's no imagination sometimes about how things can be because this is the way we've always done it.
And there's no, there's also no thought about, okay, well let's see what other people are doing.
Let's see how other people are doing it. Let's not reinvent the wheel.
They were all about reinventing wheels.
[00:06:56] Speaker A: How did you imagine it could be?
[00:07:00] Speaker B: So there's a lot of information on Facebook and Facebook groups everywhere that of what people are doing, how people are setting up. People ask questions all the time. What are you using for software? What are you using for this? And people give all their example, all their suggestions.
And yet that firm was. Was focused on your old school type one software to rule them all. Your NYB, your reckon APS, your whole handysoft CCH1 software to rule them all rather than a whole lot of little softwares who do things each thing and it will integrate together. Like they had no imagination to look beyond the one big bomb.
[00:07:41] Speaker A: That's an interesting concept like. Cause that's. I've always been a like a aficionado for best in class tools rather than everything in one. And I know there's a market for both and I know there's pros and cons to both ways. Like obviously disparate tools mean more like you're having to connect things together and whatever. But like I don't know. I've always just thought that was so much better.
[00:08:02] Speaker B: Everyone wants their one thing, does it very, very well, integrates and you still get the benefit of the one software to rule them all. But everyone's doing their one focused on their one thing. But also if someone. Something else comes along, it's easy to swap it out.
That one little part.
[00:08:18] Speaker A: Yeah, of course that's a good caveat
[00:08:20] Speaker B: that we're never swapping contents. Never. Okay. Just love it.
[00:08:25] Speaker A: It's going on the testimonial wall. So is that kind of what you. That's how you wanted to attack it from day one is. Is like yeah, best in class tools.
[00:08:34] Speaker B: Yeah. Start with a base of 0 which seems to be the center of the ecosystem. And then I went the first four things that I signed up for right at the very beginning was Microsoft 365. That's sort of a given zero content, snare ignition. They were the first four. And then everything kind of evolved around that.
[00:08:55] Speaker A: And that you mentioned before, you learn a lot of this from the Facebook groups. Is that kind of where you get some of your like how do you discover new apps and how do you discover and decide what you're going to use in the name of.
In the name of efficiency.
[00:09:09] Speaker B: Then we should see recommendations are big from other people who use the software. So people going in the Facebook groups and saying what do you use for this? And everyone's recommending and if, if a lot of people are recommending the one thing obviously that's something that's, that's popular and it's gotta be for a reason. So recommendations from that, I go to like accounting expert 0con and that and actually talk to the vendors, watch webinar demo, demo webinars, things like that, do trials.
[00:09:39] Speaker A: You know, it's interesting that a lot of these things you were saying, there are people I know that would just like, just would hate all of this and would avoid it.
[00:09:48] Speaker B: I love all. That's my favorite.
I had six months between quit quitting my job and officially launching and I pretty much filled that six months with, with setting all this up and it was.
[00:09:57] Speaker A: Yeah. Oh yeah, yeah. No, I'm not saying everyone should hate it, but it's just funny how like, you know, you get so much benefit from these and I do. Right. Like I love going to events for various reasons. I go to different types of events. Sometimes it's like entrepreneurial type stuff, sometimes it's accounting stuff. And I'm selling to accountants obviously. Sometimes it's accountants where I'm just a fly on the wall hearing about accountants problems, you know, or I love all events and stuff. But I like, I can think of one particular person who is so against all of this stuff. He was on my LinkedIn commented yesterday on one of my posts that he, I don't think he said he doesn't think he's heard someone speak in 15, 20 years. Like he's literally never heard a speaker from stage in that long because he avoids this stuff like the plague. Right.
And there are obviously scales of this where people are like, I don't want to go to events and talk to tech vendors. I don't want to go to demos or webinars. I'm that like, I hate going to webinars and demos. So that took me a long time to learn in the accounting industry that people want that stuff and there, there is actual value for people.
[00:10:57] Speaker B: But yeah, we want to talk to the people face to face in person.
[00:11:01] Speaker A: Oh my God, you guys do. Yeah, like the, it took a long time in accounting. You know, there was. The momentum is there now, but it took a long time to build because people have got to hear about you like a hundred times before they actually I think the normal figure is like seven touch points or something. It used to be. Now I feel in accounting I feel like it's a hundred.
You got to talk to you here and see you on the Facebook group and go to a webinar or whatever. But yeah, it's super relationship based and, and everyone wants to see what everyone else is.
[00:11:27] Speaker B: Megan.
[00:11:27] Speaker A: I mean you're clearly doing a very good job of that. So tell me about then. So you signed up for back on. You know, you starting a business or there's putting processes and tools in place is one thing. But how did you get it off the ground?
[00:11:42] Speaker B: I started off with a couple of friends who had businesses.
That was a starting point. I also, I got a casual bookkeeping job just one day a week. Well, it was advertised as one day a week just to get some money in. I quit my job and I managed to efficientize. That's a new word in that. So that what was originally told to me by my predecessor there was like four to six hours on a Monday. I turned into comfortably an hour and a half.
[00:12:17] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:12:17] Speaker B: On a Monday and then 15, 20 minutes on a Wednesday.
So I, I, I almost automated myself out of a job and it got to the point where there wasn't much point doing it further because I was in a casual employee with a minimum three hour shift. Right. According to Fair Work. So there wasn't much point in improving it any further. But yeah, I did that and that business ended up being a client. We swapped.
I quit my job and they, they become a client. I've got a bunch of clients through them, people who contract to them and in that ecosystem there and that industry.
A couple followed me from my previous firm and they've referred people. So it's all just been referrals.
[00:13:03] Speaker A: Classic.
And I think there's another point. There is like the network effect of working with companies that have access to more of your ideal clients.
I don't know what that, that one, that company you're talking about was. But an example here is in our web design days, IT companies are really good because lots of people go to an IT company and go can you help me with my website? And they would no, we don't do that.
You know, so anything you can line up like that is, is an incredible referral source that it's like a leveraged referral source. You know, you don't have to go and get all your clients individually. You get one of these clients or slash referral partner, they continue to refer things to you forever. Which is a great angle.
[00:13:47] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:13:48] Speaker A: What can, what light can you shed on how you got that job down from whatever it was six hours to one.
What did that include for the job
[00:13:56] Speaker B: was predominantly payroll and the, it wasn't that hard honestly because the person who'd been doing it before me, she was a semi retired banker. And so and she was doing everything correctly. She was just doing everything extremely inefficiently.
There were spreadsheets upon spreadsheets and she was copying from one spreadsheet to another spreadsheet and then there into Xero. So the employees, all casual, were doing their timesheets in Excel and they were copying from those into another spreadsheet. She didn't have formulas set up in Excel because she didn't trust them.
[00:14:29] Speaker A: Oh, my Lord.
[00:14:30] Speaker B: For while she's literally telling me that I'm typing the formula into Excel because we're not doing that. So, yeah, she had spreadsheets going into spreadsheets and then copy from there into Xero payroll. So what I did was I did away with all the spreadsheets. I got the employees on apps at the time. Zero's Zero and Me app with the timesheets wasn't fair work compliant. That came out a bit later.
So I got the client onto an actual payroll solution from Employment Hero keypay. And so the employees now all had timesheets in their apps and that fed straight through into Employment Hero and that integrated with Xerox. And so now we didn't have to type and retype and all of that. That took a bit of setting up. But once it was set up so
[00:15:13] Speaker A: much quicker, it's kind of a reminder of just how much waste and inefficiency there is out there. And like it's, you know, this is obviously years ago before the time of, you know, that we're in now with AI just rapidly advancing. And it's interesting because I've been, I wouldn't say anti AI, but very realistic about what AI can and can't do.
And something's changed in the last couple of months, right? This is being recorded in March, in March 2026.
And now I feel like that gap is changing really quickly between people who are.
What is inefficient, sorry, what was efficient like 3 months ago is very different than what's efficient now. And so that's what's changing really fast. And like, you don't have. In my opinion, you don't have to be on top of everything.
[00:16:05] Speaker B: But it does help at least to have a background knowledge of what's going on, even if you're not completely on top of everything, which you can't be because it's changing so much. Like you said, at least have a background idea of what's going on.
[00:16:18] Speaker A: And I think it helps. Like, I think you've probably developed a skill in the way you've got Lots of apps sort of plugging in together and working rather than they're all in one scenario.
I think that mindset helps a lot with AI and automation in general because, like, you have this sort of. I don't know, the way of thinking about it is like building blocks and how you connect the different things together. And.
And that is. There's a lot of that in AI that, like, I feel like someone who doesn't play around with apps and have that mentality would struggle a bit more. You know, I. I'm able to build things by saying I want to have like a, you know, a workflow that does this and then I want to plug the results of that into this and then that's going to go back over here, you know, and that mentality comes from wanting to plug lots of different pieces together. I don't think you.
Yeah, 100%.
Some people would hate the idea of that, but I like, I.
Efficiency gains right now is incredible.
[00:17:14] Speaker B: That's the fun part.
[00:17:16] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. As long as you don't get too far. Right. Like, some people, like, they'll spend their entire bloody day on this stuff.
[00:17:23] Speaker B: I. I could. I need intervention sometimes. No need.
No new apps.
[00:17:28] Speaker A: Totally. Yeah. The shiny object thing, I think you can just kind of be pragmatic about this kind of stuff too. Like, is it.
Is this problem really big right now? Obviously with content Snare, you went in the beginning, you went. I do not want to chase people for stuff that sucks.
[00:17:41] Speaker B: Right, Absolutely.
[00:17:43] Speaker A: And so it's an obvious case use case there it was like, you know, in the document management world, you want to use Document Manager because you don't want to have to find, you know, spend all your time looking for documents or whatever. If something is like an incremental improvement improvement, then it's like, no, you have to be able to recognize that shiny object in yourself. And a lot of AI, that's what AI has mostly been for me up till a couple of months ago. And now like the stuff I'm able to build, it's like, no, these are legitimate big improvements. So, like, that's why I'm starting to actually dive into it.
[00:18:13] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:18:14] Speaker A: And I don't know, just seeing what people say to, like, you can read between the lines. Everyone talking about OpenClaw is one of the big ones at the moment.
And like, I could tell that was a waste of time, all the stupid stuff they were building with it. And then now I'm starting to see all the posts being like, yeah, I wasted all this time and all this money and credits and it was fine. And I can. It's like a window into the future of what it's going to be like. And I'm like, that's cool. That's kind of what it looked like to me before. Like, if you stand back from these things and look at them for what they are, then you don't waste time going down the shiny object route.
[00:18:47] Speaker B: But sometimes, is it a waste of time or is it learning what doesn't work?
[00:18:52] Speaker A: I mean. Oh, yeah, you obviously have to do both and everything is a learning experience, but it becomes a problem when you're learning too much about what doesn't work.
[00:19:01] Speaker B: Yeah. Too much time on what doesn't. Yeah, yeah. I feel like I said early.
[00:19:06] Speaker A: Yeah. There's probably a level of, like, experience that comes with this, you know, like, if you saw all the LinkedIn posts, you had no idea about AI and just you weren't very technical and you saw all the stuff about Openclaw or whatever, you'd probably go, oh, my God, I need to be on this. But if you've seen enough stuff, eventually you get it.
[00:19:25] Speaker B: Yeah. I'm limited on all this experimentation by need for confidentiality and security.
So I can't just go hell for leather on all the AIs. I have to be very, very careful about what I do and what I share and how I use it.
[00:19:36] Speaker A: Well, there's legislation for that kind of stuff, isn't there? Yeah, yeah, exactly.
So is there anything else you think you did when you were starting your own business that, like, other people could learn from?
[00:19:47] Speaker B: I doubted myself.
I had at the time, 13 years experience, and I'm like, am I even ready? And there are people going out there getting the tax agent license with, like, two, four, five years experience. And I'm like, and here in my 13 years at the time, doubting myself, can this actually work?
And I almost didn't do it because I'm like, what if I fail? And my mum said to me, well, what if you do? What's the worst case scenario? What do you do then? I'm like, well, I'll just go get another job. There was a, you know, shortage of senior accountants. I could go the job. She says, well, what have you got to lose then?
So I'm like, okay, that's a good point. So I doubted myself. And in hindsight, don't do that.
[00:20:28] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, the worst case scenario, exercise is really good. Whenever you take risks, it's like, if all this goes to shit, like, what am I going to do?
[00:20:35] Speaker B: Um, and. And if the answer is, well, I'll just go get another job somewhere else, and that's fairly easy to do in this particular circumstance, then what really have you got to lose?
[00:20:45] Speaker A: A hundred percent.
Cool. Well, let's go back to events. And I mean, we can probably combine this with the Facebook group. Because you're like, when I say the Facebook group, I'm talking about Small Business advisors. Brain Trust. I can never remember the full name of it.
[00:21:00] Speaker B: Brain Trust Australia.
[00:21:01] Speaker A: I literally have a keyboard shortcut for the name of it. Because I can't, like, because I can't remember it. It's just dot SBA is. Is my shortcut. Because anyway. Yeah. Cause you get quite involved in that helping other people and. And reading and also going to all the events as an introvert. So that's obviously quite an energy inefficient.
[00:21:21] Speaker B: But that's the point for me is to get out of my comfort zone. Because my comfort zone would just be to not go to anything and stay home.
[00:21:29] Speaker A: But why, like, why, like, that you get out of your comfort zone. Is that. Is. Is it just about personal growth for
[00:21:34] Speaker B: you or is it personal challenge? Yeah, it started off as a personal challenge. Like, let's just see what happens if I just say yes to all these events and go.
And then I started meeting people and people. And it's not just about me knowing who people are, but also people started to know who I am.
They started to be able to recognize and say, hi, Jackie. I'm like, oh, you know me. And so now it's become less of a chore, if you know what I mean.
[00:21:59] Speaker A: What is that? Like, if you step back, even it'll go even higher than that. Like, what are you.
What benefit does this bring you? Let's say outside of the personal growth level, Are you going to learn things and get recommendations and to see what people are doing?
[00:22:14] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, you always learn things. I always chat with people.
What are you doing?
How do you do whatever it happens to be. How do you do this? What do you do this? And you could get. Because the whole point is collaboration. This industry is not about competition. It's all about collaboration, everyone learning from each other.
And that's the thing that makes us.
That makes so good, I think makes this events pillar and is the fact that everyone is just learning from each other.
[00:22:41] Speaker A: I have always been amazed since I came into the accounting industry how collaborative. Collaborative it is. Like in some other industries, like, it can feel a bit more competitive. Like, you know, everyone there is in the same Industry, you could also have the same clients. Therefore it feels like, you know, helping your competitors. But in accountant, in accounting, everyone seems to be quite happy to help each other out. There's obviously plenty of work to go around, right?
[00:23:05] Speaker B: Yes. Yeah.
[00:23:06] Speaker A: I think it's a little bit different because accountants are so sticky. Like a web designer. They get a web job and then they've got to try and keep that person from going to another agency for the next part of the step or whatever. Right. Whereas accountants tend to hold on to clients for quite a long time. So I think it changes the dynamic
[00:23:21] Speaker B: a little bit into a. A personal trainer at my gym once. And that industry is toxic amongst all the trainers. Yeah, they're real. They're really at loggerheads with each other all the time.
[00:23:33] Speaker A: Yeah. I think. I think you'd have to be crazy to not take advantage of this in the accounting industry and get involved. I think what really stuck out to me there is that you're going in with like, intentional questions, you know, like asking people how they're doing and what they do. Because easy to go to these events and then just talk shit. Like, I didn't generally.
[00:23:51] Speaker B: Well, a large part of the My tech stack, my app stack is let's steal other people's ideas.
What is everyone else doing?
What is everyone else using? Let's do that. Because if it's working for them, let's not reinvent the wheel.
[00:24:08] Speaker A: How about the Facebook group? Like, what's your sort of. Do you just enjoy helping people in there? Like, because you're obviously commenting and helping people quite regularly.
[00:24:17] Speaker B: I try to. You get the imposter syndrome. Right? You get the people asking the questions. You're like, I think I know the answer to this. But I out there because what if I'm wrong? And I think this is where all the anonymous comments, people posting under, like, you know, there's like unhinged capybara. What?
[00:24:32] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:24:32] Speaker B: That people put. But yeah, sometimes I'm like, let's just. Sometimes I think, okay, this is what I think the answer to this question is. I'm just going to keep that in my head and see what other people answer and see whether I get it right or not.
Sometimes. Sometimes if I'm confident, I put it out there at all times. If someone's asking a question that I can answer contents there too. I do that.
[00:24:53] Speaker A: I've noticed.
[00:24:55] Speaker B: I feel like sometimes I'm a little bit of a broken record on that. Maybe people sort of suss me out as being too.
[00:25:01] Speaker A: No, I don't yeah, look, I don't know, there's. Obviously, you've got fans of every product out there and.
Yeah, I don't think it's an interesting dynamic, that group, because it's. I barely go on Facebook anymore. When I do, it's pretty much only to see what's going on in there.
I think that's for a lot of people now, but it doesn't even sort of let me know, like, because I guess people don't tag me necessarily. Sometimes people tag me like, oh, cool, someone's mentioning contests now. But sometimes I have to go in and like, manually search for certain, like, keynotes or whatever to see what people are talking about.
Yeah, I mean, I really like that attitude that it's sort of, you know, that all of this is related. It's like a give and take and getting sort of suggestions and learning ways to improve your business through just collaborating with other accountants. That's kind of the. The big message here because it's very easy to not do that.
[00:25:54] Speaker B: Yep. Like my previous employer did, you can
[00:25:58] Speaker A: obviously take this too far, like. And I've done that before. I've said yes to so many events that I had to pull back. I feel like in accounting, especially in Brisbane, it'd be hard to do that because there's not that many.
[00:26:11] Speaker B: No. This means it's not unwieldy. It's not.
[00:26:14] Speaker A: If you start going to, like, small business events or like founder events or whatever. Like. No, they're like every three nights. So it's just too much. But yeah, like, I. I don't know. I tend to think that this almost also comes back to, like, the networking stuff I mentioned at the beginning. Just by being there and having people know you, it. It turns into things.
There's the concept of luck, surface area that it's like, oh, you know, you got lucky because you got some XYZ client. But it's like, yeah, that came because of, like, this person I met ages ago who knew someone here and there was like an overlap with this other net contact and they got talking and they mentioned me and they like it.
[00:26:53] Speaker B: Separation is very small.
[00:26:56] Speaker A: I just like the idea that the more I do all this stuff and it's building this, like, net to catch the. Giving me a higher chance of catching the luck when it comes past and all these things add up and it can be kind of difficult to justify that in any one time. Right. It's like, you know, if I'm trying to lose weight, I could say that this gym session that I don't want to go to this afternoon is not going to do anything in the grand scheme.
[00:27:20] Speaker B: Nobody does.
[00:27:22] Speaker A: But if I. Yeah. It all adds up.
[00:27:24] Speaker B: It all adds up. There's a. There's that 1% improvement every day thing.
[00:27:30] Speaker A: A hundred percent. And so like I see this kind of the same way. It's all these little things you're doing do contribute to that luck. Surface area. And so things work out.
[00:27:40] Speaker B: I like that concept. Lux surface area.
[00:27:42] Speaker A: It's not mine. I stole it. Like most things. Very few original thoughts in this brain.
[00:27:47] Speaker B: No. You. You're not revamping the wheel.
It's efficiency.
[00:27:51] Speaker A: Was a great artist. Steel or something.
There we go.
Jackie, is there anything you'd like to add to anyone listening to this before we wrap it up?
[00:28:02] Speaker B: Just don't. The biggest thing is if you are starting your own business, whatever business it is, don't doubt yourself. Just back yourself. Just go for it and do it anyway because. What's the word for nothing?
[00:28:13] Speaker A: 100%. There it is. Jackie, thanks so much for coming on.
[00:28:17] Speaker B: It's all right. Thank you for having me. Appreciate it.
